A couple of things not to do (Hawk instrument panels)

[chris.richard]

I've been sorting my binnacle/instrument panel to sort out issues from its initial construction by the original owner. I had just accepted them as the way they were, but eventually twigged that it could be much better, so hopefully I can stop someone else having the same problem. Or maybe it's made obvious in the updated build manual!

The front panel of the binnacle had not been cut away, but just had instrument holes the same as the ally front panel. The instruments were mounted into these, which meant that to get at the back of the instruments, you had to remove the whole binnacle, which is a royal PITA with the seat and windscreen in. Lesson 1:- cut out the front panel of the binnacle, leaving enough to mount rivnuts in to screw the aluminium panel onto. The instruments mount on this removeable panel, and the binnacle is permanantly fixed to the dash.

The looms to the instruments on my car are too short. The worst is the speedo cable, which needs a child's hands or a gynaecologists fingers to attach the threaded collar onto the speedo. Lesson 2:- make your wiring to the instruments 18" / 0.5m longer than appears necessary, so that the instrument panel can be removed and the back worked on easily. Think carefully about the routing of the speedo cable so that it is long enough to attach easily.

Picture of binnacle in process of modification:

[Matt No VAT]

Chris, some really good ideas there - I had already of the first one you highlighted, but I admit that I hadn't considered the second to that degree.

I would have only made them long enough to flip it forward and work on it that way making cable 3 - 4 inches longer than required, but you have enhanced that idea further by allowing the whole fascia panel to move forward for better accessibility when working on it.

Makes perfect / practical sense ! :)

Top man

[Steve Poole]

Very good idea Chris. How do you get on with those rivnuts are they easy & reliable to use? I noticed John H had them everywhere on his build - at least i think they are rivnuts what is everyone using for repeated fixing?

Steve

[Chris J]

Steve

Rivnuts are better than self tappers
Anchor nuts are better than rivnuts (well I think they are?)
Floating anchor nuts are better still for some applications (but more expensive)

[Steve Poole]

I shall have to sample those from the local engineering supplies shop.

Your repsonse reminded me of a Morrisey song:

Some girls are bigger than others,
Some girls mothers are bigger than other girls mothers :p

Sorry Chris - warped sense of humour :p

Steve

[chris.richard]

Anchor nuts need a bit more room on each side than Rivnuts.
Rivnuts come in steel, stainless and aluminium - there can be corrosion problems with stainless bolts in ali nuts.
I wouldn't use self-tappers in a car.

[mudhut]

I've taken a different approach to this.

I'm trying to get rid of as many rivnuts as possible due to corrosion probs. When they do corrode they tend to come loose in the GRP causing more grief.

Replacing with s/s self-tappers wherever possible into small square purpose made plastic plugs. Tracking down s/s self tappers with Philips heads is proving to be a bit of a problem!

[Matt No VAT]

Peter,

Do you mean your replacing rivnuts with the square plastic block like those used on Beta / Delta doors, you screw into them causing them to expand slightly and secure everything in place.

I've been trying to find a round version of these, as round holes are easier to drill than square ones! ;)

I'd even consider having them made if I knew who to approach - then copyright it and make millions! (But someone may have beaten me to it)

(you can tell its Friday!!)

[Steve Poole]

I always thought a square drill would sell :D but a tapered square file bit for a special reciprocating drill (modify an etcher....) was my dream...damn should have copyrighted that.....remember me when you've made your millions whomever... :p :p

Need to get hold of some of these fasteners and experiment methinks :)

Steve

[chris.richard]

I'm trying to get rid of as many rivnuts as possible due to corrosion probs. When they do corrode they tend to come loose in the GRP causing more grief.


Is that ali or steel corrosion?

[Chris J]

Last page of this thread:

http://www.stratossupersite.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2336&page=4&pp=15&highlight=floating+nuts

[mudhut]

Is that ali or steel corrosion?

I've had a few screws corrode into rivnuts so that's steel to steel. They are then a pig to remove once the rivnut spins and that is all to easy in GRP or Ali - had probs with both. Plastic inserts aren't going to give me this trouble.

I took a step back and asked myself "Does the car look like a carefully home made special?" Answer was yes - mainly due to the use of things like rivnuts and nylocs, so I decided that when I started work on it, I'd try to give it more of a "productionised" look, so aside of the corrosion thing, I think I'd be doingthis anyway. As jobs turn up and time permitting, I'll gradually try to keep rivnuts for where they are really needed.

[strat6v]

I don't fit rivnuts directly into the grp, better to fit them in a metal strip and fit them behind the grp with some rivets, or as CJ says 'Anchornuts' Guess i'm just too tight.

[Chris J]

Anyhow, fasteners aside, Chris R's point about making fascia removal easy is a good one.

John H. suggested narrowing down the fascia items into one or two multi plugs, rather than having the standard Fiat set up of half a dozen. I'm planning to do that.

Here's another related thread:

http://www.stratossupersite.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1411&highlight=sewing+thread

[rutthenut]

I split the loom section behind the instrument panel, so all those feeds go through a single multi-way connector. This allows me to disconnect the whole metal panel with the instruments intact. As Matt pointed out though, the speedo cable is a real git.

[strat6v]

I found some nice multipin connectors with a locking mechanism on a 164 i think. The pins are available from rs and i have an extraction tool to remove the old ones. Takes the same pins as the 24v circular management loom connector, up to 30 amps

[CorseChris]

Did most of the above with mine as well. Made a sub-loom for all the dash instruments so it's 3 plugs & sockets (of different ways so they can't get mixed up), easy route for the speedo cable so the dash panel can pull out plenty far enough to easily access the retaining ring, floating nut plates for fixing the ali panel to the FG housing, nothing but a mounting lip on the binnacle. Makes working on it pretty straightforward on the whole and well worth the initial effort. One or two subsequent mods have slightly deviated from this but they are simple things that don't make the job any harder should I need to pull the panel.