SVA- Failure

[DavidM]

I knew it wasn't going to go well when the first thing the guy said was..... Oh we haven't had one of these before... He then proceeded with nearly 4 hours of microscopic testing.Perhaps Norwich wasn't a good idea. Still the fail points could have been worse.
1.2 bolts on the rod connecting brake pedal to rocker need securing pins
2.Heater decided to air lock so failed on no warm air for demisting
3.Handbrake failed to reach 18% only 15%
4.He found a small fuel leakage from the accelerator pump underneath one of the carbs
5.Must provide evidence that the steering column(X1/9) has a collapsible section or fit a collapsible steering boss
6.The external mirror was too low
7.The front wheels aren't sufficiently covered by the body

Most of the things are easily fixed , I have managed to find a reference in a Fiat X1/9 workshop manual for the steering column.

The front wheels are more of an issue, I have 8in Minilites so I could go down in width (at a cost)but even say 6in is going to cause a problem at the front. He suggested adding rubber spats. Any body else had this issue ?

Still at least it didn't fail on the balance bar , the speedo or noise (94) which I thought it might.

Any ideas to sort the wheel protrusion problem would be appreciated.

David M

[Swamprat33]

David, some kind chap may have a set of 7" mini's you could borrow.

Tim

[BAS]

The front wheels are more of an issue, I have 8in Minilites so I could go down in width (at a cost)but even say 6in is going to cause a problem at the front. He suggested adding rubber spats. Any body else had this issue ?

Could you add more negative camber, as I understand it they should only measure the projection above the floor line determined by the 30 deg cone.

I was look at this as I also have 8" fronts, also it's only the rim not the tyre that is measured. Well thats my understanding anyway.

[BAS]

The front wheels are more of an issue, I have 8in Minilites so I could go down in width (at a cost)but even say 6in is going to cause a problem at the front. He suggested adding rubber spats. Any body else had this issue ?

Could you add more negative camber, as I understand it they should only measure the projection above the floor line determined by the 30 deg cone.

I was look at this as I also have 8" fronts, also it's only the rim not the tyre that is measured. Well thats my understanding anyway.

Ok, just been reading the SVA manual & the wheels fall under the vehicle body plan form not the floor line so adding more camber would only move the top of the wheel in leaving the bottom still sticking out (maybe).

[SUSIT]

Not sure I understand the issue with the front wheels, I have always thought the fronts were well covered on any of the Stratos I have seen. I have 7 X 15 Revolution five spoke ET -10 (98mm 4 stud ) but I am not sure if they fit a Hawk and postage would cost a bit but I dont mind lending them.
Any chance you can post a picture to show the problem?

Cheers

Stephen

[rutthenut]

I think I originally had 8-1/2" split-rim wheels, and didn't think they protruded at all. That was with 225 width tyres.

Now use either 8" (zero offset) or 7" single-piece wheels (Compomotive MOs) and they do not stick out, even with wheel spacers fitted.

Have some smaller Minilites on my 'other' kit, which don't seem to be a problem either. May be a problem fitting different wheels over your brakes, but using alternatives for the SVA has to be better than fitting spats or any other bodywork mods.

Whereabouts are you (presume East Anglia), and how soon do you plan to have the car re-tested?

What size tyres are you using? Would the problem be resolved with 205 width front tyres, or is the wheel rim too far out in any case?

[DavidM]

The line for projection is taken from a horizontal line though the hub,all the wheel (not tyre) above this line must be inside the body form plan. This is not the floorline as defined by the cone test but the actual contours which of course on a Stratos curve dramatically inwards. I think my problem is the 8in width and -16 offset on the wheels.Lowering a bit will help (now I dont have to meet minimum height for lights as they passed) I am going to do some measuring today then might be looking to borrow some narrower wheels 4 stud 98 PCD - brakes are standard Fiat .
David M

[CorseChris]

I had the same issue with front wheel/body on my SVA. It failed by about 5mm. It was suggested (cough) by the examiner that maybe the car was toeing out a bit, and perhaps I should adjust the tracking (cough cough). I did this and the projection was then re-measured. It passed. I then scrabbled my way out of the testing area over to the car park and re-set the tracking.

[catswhiskers]

Hi David,
I was warned about the 'wheel' thing by the examiner when I went to see them a week before the test. I just left the Alfa wheels on for the test. Looked a bit spazzy :p but it did the trick.
I dont understand the 'warm air' for de-misting though. :eek:
I was under the impression that as long as you had air blowing onto the screen, you satisfied the requirement.
I have the full manual at home, I'll have a look to satisfy my curiosity. :confused:

Mick

[rutthenut]

Seems that it might just be possible for you to frig this with additional negative camber (for 'all the wheel above the hub centre line') and zero toe-in/toe-out, if you are lucky

[BAS]

How about bolting on a plank of wood (with the correct radius) sticking out from the bottom of chassis as a kind of side skirt to change the body form plan. Yes I am joking.

[SUSIT]

How about bolting on a plank of wood (with the correct radius) sticking out from the bottom of chassis as a kind of side skirt to change the body form plan. Yes I am joking.


Shape some foam, thin layer of glass and resin, paint and attach using douple sided stickytape.

Take for retest then remove at first layby on exit.

Sell or rent to next SVA candidate :) :)

[AndyH]

Hi,

I've 7" Compomotive on the front and 8" on the rear.. From memory a 10mm offset.

Front not a problem.. rears squeezed in by about 1mm.

I had some 205/55/16 tyres all round (A friend had some spare tyres, and I built the car whilst using these... they're still legal so though why go to extra expense).

Assuming you have rose joints top and bottom, have a look at how far wound out they are... You cound wind them all in to bring the whole track in??

Andrew

[BAS]

David

I had a look at my car and think I see what you mean, as the front of the bonnet curves round the leading edge of the wheel rim falls outside the body plan form.

Have a look at this old link http://www.stratossupersite.com/forum/showthread.php?t=357&highlight=chin

You my find fitting the chin spoiler shown in the first photo could solve the problem. I have one and could offer it up on my car and take some photos if you like.

[DavidM]

Seeing light... just found in the undergrowth 2 wheels 5 1/2J and tyres off the donor Beta and they get 95% covered by the body, so if I just add some simple part mudflaps at the back of the arch and make up a 1in by 6in wide strip of ally or glass at the front it should pass.
Looks awful better paint them gold at least to match the backs.

On the heater the failure reason is for no defrost which you obviously need warm air for.

Haven't looked at the handbrake yet but it suddenly struck me that I have newish grooved Beta front disks fitted on the back which are 251x13mm thick with Beta rear calipers and partworn pads . The standard rear Beta disk is 251x10mm, they are cheap (£18 each) and easy to get ,should I be using these thus matching up to the calipers?.
Rear brakes are fine on the footpedal and passed no problem only the handbrake that failed at 15 v 18 and there is a 16% imbalance side to side.

Thanks for your input so far
David M

[BAS]

davidm

you have a PM

[pimms]

5.Must provide evidence that the steering column(X1/9) has a collapsible section or fit a collapsible steering boss

Most of the things are easily fixed , I have managed to find a reference in a Fiat X1/9 workshop manual for the steering column.

David M

Hi David,
Were can I find this evidence, and were is this collapsible section?

[strat6v]

There isn't one. I'd suggest using your alfa wheel with its collapsible boss, cut out the splined slug and weld the old x19 one in somehow. Saves buying something and its only temporary.

[Sando]

The way the shaft goes through two UJs and is angled not straight to the rack is a designed as collapsable column. If this can be seen point him to the section in the book that I'm pretty sure says this is acceptable.

Rob

[strat6v]

Did actually think that myself bobster :confused:

[CorseChris]

...I almost added this earlier myself - 2 UJs and a change of direction were sufficient for my SVA tester.

[pimms]

The way the shaft goes through two UJs and is angled not straight to the rack is a designed as collapsable column. If this can be seen point him to the section in the book that I'm pretty sure says this is acceptable.

Rob

I will have to be looking for a collapsible boss then cause my intermidiate shaft runs straight to my steering rack, like the original :( . How does a boss like that look like :confused:

[DavidM]

I have a Haynes manual Fiat X1/9 its a US version and the general description says ...The steering column is in 3 parts with 2 universal joints and a collapsible joint which prevents the steering column being forced into the car in the event of an accident.. unquote.
The exploded view shows a section in the inner column which looks just like the collapsible example in the SVA manual.
OK so its a US version, but who knows that the column I've fitted isnt out of a US car - the steering wheel is the same one I've got fitted and if he insists on seeing the column (after dismantaling lower dash area) the mounting brackets on the outer column also look the same. Think I'll take a risk, he's being nitpicking anyway .
DavidM

[pimms]

would this be a collapsible boss :confused:

[strat6v]

It is Pim, In an impact the sheet metal section would deflect where the bends and the holes are. Go with that, it will be fine. :)

[Shaun II]

I'm not an expert but I would think your feet(toes) could get caught between those pedels and the shaft. I'm off to look at mine again.

[Arthur]

The heater/demister - the manual says "must have an efficient means of demisting the screen". There's a lot of room there for interpretation, and unfortunately it's all the examiner's discretion. Err on the side of a lot of air, and heat as well. Bitch if your installation fails.......