Intro

[NITO]

Hi Everyone,

I've been lurking here for a while now and thought it was time to introduce myself.

I've been toying with the idea of a Stratos Concept for a little while and have just been quietly doing my research!!

Unfortunately modern cars seem to have lost their way now IMHO with far too much weight/ millions of airbags, poor steering etc. In fact there is nothing out there that really appeals to me at the moment.

Historically I have always had highly tuned Japanese cars, Imprezas/Supras/Skylines and its a scene that I've had enough of now and totally lacking in soul. I'm wanting to get back to the core of driving now - less seems to be more when it comes to driver involvement although I am a bit of a power merchant.

My last performance car was a 700bhp R34 Skyline which in spite of its awesome power was just too heavy and too expensive to run to be really enjoyable. I did virtually all the work on this myself including removing the engine/box and stripping it down and building up the replacement engine to its final spec. I also carried out a nut & bolt rebuild of my R32 GTR 'track car' which I sold in pieces before ever getting to use.(which is a little soul destroying after putting so many hours into it -something I see a few here know of, having to sell part completed kits)

From what I've read it probably doesn't qualify me for a 'kit car builder' but I hope it'll help ;)

I've always loved rear wheel drive cars, rally cars and Italian cars, but apart from an old Fiat 127 Abarth, I've never really owned an Italian car due to reliability. The Stratos embodies all these things in one, and should make a great track car judging by what I've read and reading about the success of the various kits in motorsport.

I have spoken to both Gerry and Lionel and each kit seems to have their respective merits. Any advice/criticisms or pointers would be very welcome, via pm's if preferred!

With regards engine choice, I have been mulling over a couple of smashed up Ferrari's with the 3.6 V8 engine/F1 box. I don't know if this has been done before although I gather the 308 V8 has been used, hopefully the newer engine is more compact despite the extra cc's. It's just a highly over ambitious thought at the moment, with the V6 24v Alfa a very nice engine to fall back on ;) .

I gather the Corse 'I', has more space for this type of configuration and may be slightly better suited for this power level with its stiffer chassis/double wishbone configuration??

Anyway, I'm probably not looking to dive in until next year and I gather these kits have a 4-6 month lead in anyway which suits me as we're in the middle of extensive house work at the moment.

I'm concerned about the quoted build times, I'd be planning to let a bodyshop sort out the bodywork, I'm not worried about the electrics which seems to take up a lot of time for many, it's one of my forte's (famous last words) or the chassis/engine side of things. But I'm useless with fibreglass and manufacturing/fabrication. I've never really welded or anything, same with the interior, but once its up and running I'm happy to spend more time on the interior.

I haven't really found much in the way of driving experiences of these cars, what are they like once built? I'd like to hear some opinions on this... Are they awesome, or is it a bit of a dissapointment after all the work. I really need to have a drive in one before taking the plunge to see if I could live with one, find it comfortable and generally 'get on' with it.

Anyway, enough about me, it's a great forum, I've enjoyed the reading so far and it seems you're all a friendly and helpful bunch!

Thanks
Nito

[strat6v]

If you are in the Uk, the stratos enthusiasts club have a static display at Silverstone tomorrow and sunday. :) plenty to see at the historic festival also :D

Perhaps you could let us know where abouts you live? then we could point you in the direction of the nearest owners for you to visit.

Feel free to join in the banter on these forums, we are a sociable lot and love to 'talk stratos'. any questions that you have we'll be happy to answer. :)

[NITO]

Hi John,

Thanks. I'm based in Canterbury, Kent.

Regards
Nito

[chris.richard]

Hi Nito- your background sounds ideal for building a replica!
Nobody is ever disappointed with the performance once finished. Maybe not be as fast as your Skyline, but perfectly satisfying/frightening! Think:-
kart handling + 230 bhp of go = :D :D

[rutthenut]

Nito, if you aren't up to fabrication/welding work, you will need someone good to sort out any possible installation of later Ferrari engine+transmission into the engine bay - whichever kit manufacturer you go for.

Both Gerry and Lionel will be able to point to 308-type installations, but the later stuff has not been tried.

Don't the newer Ferrari's use an in-line engine setup, rather than transverse? If so, you will probably struggle to get it in there.

As for driving the car, I think you would find it a huge leap (backwards, in technical terms) from the electrickery of high-power turbo rice-burners :-o (said as the owner of a Mitsi Evo, which just does not remotely compare to the Stratos for feel or response)

Going fast in a Stratos is a very good test of driver ability. It helps a lot to have some rwd experience, which is less and less common in drivers these days (old git comment). Not at all like what you can get away with in a fwd or 4wd car - the mid-engined, short wheelbase, layout means the car will change direction very quickly. The clever thing is getting it to do that when you want it to. Getting it wrong, with too slow reactions, or over-optimistic driving, will result in a very rapid rotation of the car!

[NITO]

Hi John,

Your car/results is actually one of the examples that has convinced me that the Stratos may be what I'm looking for in a car. I totally understand where you are coming from with regards RWD, I've had a few rear wheel drive cars including a 600bhp Supra.

I've also spent a fair bit of time in Lotus Elises which again are lightweight/short wheelbase which switched ends far quicker than the Supra which is a lot more progressive in nature albeit that it could spin the rear wheels at triple figure speeds in the wet!

Which car do you prefer to drive between the evo and the stratos? I hate electro trickery and permanently disabled the traction control on the supra as well as the 4wheel steer nonsense on the GTR. The Subaru AWD and the skyline front torque splitting were both excellent systems that serve a very useful purpose, but I guess for me now, I'm looking more for fun than outright A-B pace in any conditions and was considering an Elise, so I'm actually looking purposely to take a step back in technology.

With regards the Ferrari engine, it is longitudinal, Lionel feels it would definately fit but would probably mean sacrificing some of the boot. As appealing as it sounds, I think I'd be frightened of breaking the Ferrari lump due to the potential repair costs so would probably end up going the Alfa 24v route, there are afterall plenty of solutions to 'boost' it if performance is lacking.

Chris, thanks for your reply, Kart handling sounds good to me!! I would be planning to use the car for the odd trackday, maybe three to four a year and some Sunday morning fun/club events as well as some commuting in the summer.

John, are you still using the Stadale, or are you running the Gp.4 setup with wider tyres now?

Thanks again,
Nito

[Matt No VAT]

Hi Nito,

Sounds like you are in the same place I was about six years ago. I was driving a Lancia Integrale Evo 2 and a Lancia HF4WD track car, but wanted something that tested/involved the driver more. I'd always loved the Stratos and theres so few of them around that it appealed to my sense of "something different".

I didn't want 4x4, torsen diff's, ABS and all the technology that comes with more modern cars anymore, I wanted a lightweight car, big engine, RWD and a responsiveness that seems to be missing in most cars.

The Stratos delivers on all counts (mine has a standard Alfa 12v 3 ltr V6). I've had over 50 different cars in my driving career and nothing even comes close to the Strat. for responsiveness, as Chris says thing go-kart handling with much more power.

My car never fails to put a huge grin on my face every time I give the pedal on the right a squeeze!

Its comfy too, OK getting in/out is not exactly graceful for but at just under 6' 5" I am certainly not uncomfortable once I'm in and buckled up.

[rutthenut]

Which car do you prefer to drive between the evo and the stratos?

Although, or perhaps because, the cars are so different, there isn't a clear answer to this one. It mostly depends on what sort of driving I intend to do.

For 'commuting' and general day-to-day stuff, the Evo is best. After all, it is a saloon car with decent grip and grunt, has a stereo, and some soundproofing, and is very easy to get along with.

But for any sort of circuit-type antics, it has to be the Strat. No question on that point.

There is also the grin-inducing aspect of driving the Strat on the road. As an owner of a Stratos replica, and exposed to many others through club meetings and the like, you tend to get a bit blase and forget about the impact this car has on others - people stopping and staring, getting cameras out to take photos on the motorway, that sort of thing.

It has exotic looks, and has many have said, it puts a smile on your face when you go out in it - often without much use of throttle at all, just the odd squirt at a roundabout, or away from a junction, reminds you how involved you are in driving such a car.

With the Evo, you (I) get a small smile when the turbo gives you some of that shove-in-the-back torque and acceleration, and a bigger smile when you get the electrickery working in your favour for a 'drifting moment' at a roundabout.

Those smiles aren't as large as the ear-to-ear grin you will have after a bit of fun in a Strat. IMHO.

(flip side being the feeling of nervousness you may experience when pushing the limit of driver or car in the Stratos, no safety margin there, and you know about it - that's why you get such a grin after getting it right. In the Evo, it isn't really a question of 'danger', you just give it a go and it [usually] does what you want and makes it all so easy for you)


John, are you still using the Stadale, or are you running the Gp.4 setup with wider tyres now?


Still running a Stradale body on my car. With 15" diameter wheels, this has a limited choice in tyre sizes - being 205 or 225 width, in most cases. Have found 235 available, so hope to try those on the rear soon. In my case, I have sets of wheels in both 7" and 8" widths. Other discussions on the forum discuss wheel and tyre options if you search for it though.

[NITO]

Thanks Guys,

Helpful stuff.

Matt, how long did the build take you and which kit did you opt for?

I haven't even sat in a Strat yet, hope it's wide enough, and not too cramped, although I should be alright for height at 5'11". Did you have to mod the seat rails/floorplan to get the clearance?

It can't be more awkward than an Elise to get in/out of, is it?! I remember seeing people crawl backwards on the showroom floor to get over the sill and out of the Lotus :D

Cheers
Nito

[mudhut]

I'm a shade over 5' 10" and it's no problem getting in an out (unless you have a door bar fitted!).

There's no high sill to drop over and heave yourself back out and as the chassis has an integral roll cage, it does not rely on the width of the sill for stiffness. No harder than an MX-5 really and definitely easier than my boy's VX220 (which he says is easier than an Elise).

[rutthenut]

In the words of Robbie Coltrane, I could claim to be something like "Six Foot One in every direction". And I can get in and out of my car, even with a door-bar fitted :)

[strat6v]

The door bars in mine actually help me get in and out, believe it or not.

[rutthenut]

Don't tell me mam i'm a builder, she thinks i play the piano in a brothel.

[Off Topic]
I take it you've read - and enjoyed - the book (Work on Oil Rigs) then?
:D
[/Off Topic]

[SUSIT]

Welcome Nito
As regards fitting a in line engine in the back of a Stratos replica, I bought my Alfa setup from a man that was fitting a V8 Lotus twin turbo in the rear of his Stratos Replica (Corse) I saw the block in situ but dont know if it progresed. They were using a Ferrari gearbox that if I remember correctly had the clutch and starter at the rear with drive coming forward from the rear to output shafts that sat almost next to the engine block thus allowing the engine to fit as far back as possible.
As previously said the Alfa propels the car along very nicely and 300Bhp is possible from a 3L 24 valve. the only downside to the standard Alfa setup is the gearing available without spending a significant sum of money.
Good luck

Stephen

[John]

Stephen,
yes thats right, Dave Carsons car is using an in-line setup of the Lotus V8 and Ferrari (355?) gearbox, and in this case has not required any modifications to the engine bay (other than mountings) from the Alfa V6 spec.
The Corse engine bay can be designed to fit any engine and gearbox combination that will physically fit size wise.

[NITO]

Thanks Susit/John,

What's wrong with the Alfa gearing, too long? Does this apply to the 5 speed/6 speed box or both?

Does anyone know what wheels/sizes are on Stuart Foster's car? I tried looking in his gallery but there aren't any pics and it doesn't appear as though he posts much. Looks stunning on the superstratos website.

btw, check out this link, it's a nice find...not sure if its a repost!

http://www.pendleslotracing.co.uk/html/body_teamslotplastic.htm

Scroll down to the Lancia section!

Regards
Nito

[NITO]

These wheels;

http://www.superstratos.com/phpnews/images/StuartsCorse1.jpg

[Swamprat33]

Hi Nito, they look to be Compomotive MO6.

Compomotive MO6 (http://www.comp.co.uk/wheels/wheels.asp?range=MO6_0006)

I have 16" Compomotive MO 5 spokes on my Corse and the wheels on Stuart's car look about the same size.

I'd guess he is running 7x16 or 8x16.

Hope that helps.

Tim

[NITO]

Thats great, thanks Tim.

Regards
Nito