Sump mods / oiling alfa V6 12v

[elvis]

Hi I was wondering what you stratos boys do with sumps on your lumps.

I'm assuming from the threads that I have read that you must be able to keep the original sump without chopping it. (this is not an option in my case , front engine / RWD )

Do you baffle the sump ?

Dry Sump ?

Oil acummulator / accusump.

I am going to have to cut about 2 1/2 inch of the sump to get any kind of ground clearence, so i have to do something.

Also, do you have oil coolers fitted. My two cars do not have oil coolers as standard (1989 lusso,and 1990 something else), but i believe that that the later models had oilcoolers as a standard fitment.
Where are the fitted on the engine, the diagrams i've seen show the pipe work coming from the area to the left and right of the oil filter, but i think my engine must be a little different from the diagrams i've seen 'cos there does not seem to any where to fit them.

Any help welcome :)

[STR470S]

Not that I'm running an Alfa V6, but I don't think anyone has had to do any mods to the sump to get it to fit in the back of the Stratos.

You might want to have a look at AH Motorsports website as there is a V6 on there that has been dry sumped :- AH Motorsport (http://www.ahmotorsports.co.uk/index2.htm)

[chris.richard]

Everybody uses standard sumps, without additional baffles or dry sumping.
You can use a sandwich plate to take off pipes to an air/oil cooler. In Stratos replicas we have a problem of airflow to the oil cooler, and some are using oil/water coolers in the radiator piping. There are threads on this. The 24v engine has an oil cooler as standard, but it's take-offs are integral to the engine mounting/filter mount. I don't think this will fit the 12v block.

[chris.richard]

You might want to have a look at AH Motorsports website as there is a V6 on there that has been dry sumped :- AH Motorsport (http://www.ahmotorsports.co.uk/index2.htm)
I see they're also doing 3.5 & 3.8 conversions for 12 & 24v V6s. Wow - scary! :o

[rutthenut]

There are threads on this. The 24v engine has an oil cooler as standard, but it's take-offs are integral to the engine mounting/filter mount. I don't think this will fit the 12v block.

The 12v Cloverleaf engine has an oil/water cooler mounted as a sandwich block behind the oil filter. Additional water pipework runs from the thermostat housing to the back and rear of the engine.

Roger Donnan did retrofit this to his car, can't remember if it made much difference - but even a small improvement in oil temp control would be useful. I recall that he had to get the adapter part for the thermostat housing from Italy, but think the other parts were available from UK Alfa dealers.

Roger - any comments?

[chris.richard]

Roger has changed to an oil/water cooler for track use, so it can't have been too effective.

[David May]

I've found 12V and 24V engine mounting/filter blocks to be interchangeable

[chris.richard]

I've found 12V and 24V engine mounting/filter blocks to be interchangeable
That's useful to know if you're using an engine from an automatic - it'll be easier to find a manual engine mount.

[Marmott]

My sump is standard, no baffles and has been rallied for a few years
I do have an oil cooler connected to a sandwich plate under the oil filter.
Specialists have advised the standard oil pump does not like to pump the oil too high to a cooler , so provided you fit it in the normal way up front should be no problem.
Capacity will be your problem when you cut the sump.
Looks like your going dry sump!!!!!!!!!

[chris.richard]

Specialists have advised the standard oil pump does not like to pump the oil too high to a cooler , so provided you fit it in the normal way up front should be no problem.

What would be the symptoms/problems caused by a high mounted oil cooler? He asks in a casual,disinterested sort of way. :eek:

[chris.richard]

Elvis, you might want one of these to practice on!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10370&item=7947367987&rd=1 ;)

[elvis]

The sump is already cut in three now.

The plan so far is ( I think, i'm not shaw, it can still change, or maybe i could)
construct a short steel sump as long as possible that is wider at the botom by about 30mm either side. Baffle and gate it, and maybe fit an oil accumulator as well.

[Martin K]

Hi

I am having some dry sump pans made in the states - if anyone is interested please get in touch. They won't be cheap and of course you will need a dry sump pump and all the other bits too.

Although designed for the Alfa V6 in another car, a dry sump could give you opportunity to lower the engine in the car, improving handling and grip, as a bonus you will have almost bomb-proof oiling!

Martin

[mogul_x]

Martin,

How much are your dry sump pans? I don't need one immediately, as my Hawk is still many years away from completion, but the oil pan on my donor engine is knackered, and will probably need replacing anyway.

[Martin K]

Martin,

How much are your dry sump pans? I don't need one immediately, as my Hawk is still many years away from completion, but the oil pan on my donor engine is knackered, and will probably need replacing anyway.

Can't really say until I have checked the import duty, but around £600 + vat.

Martin

[Martin K]

Martin,

How much are your dry sump pans? I don't need one immediately, as my Hawk is still many years away from completion, but the oil pan on my donor engine is knackered, and will probably need replacing anyway.

But of course, each time someone fits dry a sump pan hopefully good second hand standard sump pan will become available, so watch this space!

Martin

[chris.richard]

a dry sump could give you opportunity to lower the engine in the car,


No it wouldn't - the differential housing is the lowest part of the assembly, and if the sump is raised, the front bank exhaust becomes the second lowest bit :eek: In the Hawk setup, the diff is only just protected by the chassis.

[Martin K]

No it wouldn't - the differential housing is the lowest part of the assembly, and if the sump is raised, the front bank exhaust becomes the second lowest bit :eek: In the Hawk setup, the diff is only just protected by the chassis.

No steps anywhere then!

I didn't intend to mislead anyone.

If there is no cross member in the way (as in the Hawk) of course there is no benefit. As ours will be installed in-line (non-transverse) and with a different box, we can get a lot lower - particularly by having the front end lower in the car than the bellhousing end.

Martin