Tires

[tryphon]

Hello guys,

The wheels are almost here so it's time for some tire decisions.

I was considering some of the following candidates for the 8"x15" wheels:

Michelin Pilot Sport Cup: Expensive but must last longer than others

Avon ACB10: OK price but must wear out as you watch them

Avon ZZ-R: Same as above

Pirelli P Zero C: I know these ones. Price OK and don't wear out that fast

Yokhama A048-R: I know nothing on them

Other Yoko: ?

My purpose is to find a street legal tire with indifferent wet performance that doesn't wear out at the speed of light and is a great track performer while still OK on the street.

I guess the only choice for 12" wheels is the Michelin TB?

Any comments and suggestions welcome.

[guy mayers]

Hi Tryphon, it's only an opinion but here's mine based on experience with Yokohama and Pirellis!
The Yokohamas AVS on my car in 205*50*15 F and 225*50*15 R were fine in the dry and ok on the few track days I did.
After conversion to Gp4 I ran 225*50*15 F and 345*35*15 R, same in the dry BUT appalling in the wet/damp, the car just felt nervous and like it was constantly aquaplaning. Rarely took it out in the wet.
I have changed to Pirelli PZero with 225 and 345 and the car is fine in the wet, it doesn't feel at all nervous any more. I will not be fitting Yokohamas to my car ever again.
I can't comment on the Michelin TB from experience but Gerry is considering putting a bulk order together if he can get enough people interested.
I am perfectly happy to coordinate this through the Club on the same basis as the wheels consortium if there is enough interest. It may make sense to have a wheel shipped with a tyre fitted if the price of the tyre is reasonable.
Guy

[tryphon]

Hello Guy,

Are your P Zero tires symmetrical front and asymmetrical rears?

When you say you're never going back to Yokos do you mean the AVS?

I think the 345 rears will eat up a lot of power. I would really rather go for something in the 295 range but the only choice is the TB...

[Sando]

Tryphon
have you also seen the Dunlop post historic CR65 and CR82? they are also very period looking and much cheaper than the TB's
I was quoted £150 for a 12inch rear CR82.

UK specialist HP Tyre Exchnge +441327 857000
http://www.dunloptyres.co.uk/site/tyres/motorsportRange/historicVintage/index.shtml

As for bulk orders of TB15's, I'd be interested if the price was benificial to us.......You can get a 15% discount if you buy two tyres anyway........


How about a 275/55/15 Pirelli P7, a bit tall but readily available.

Rob:cool:

[tryphon]

Originally posted by Sando
have you also seen the Dunlop post historic CR65 and CR82? they are also very period looking and much cheaper than the TB's
I was quoted £150 for a 12inch rear CR82.


Are these street legal?


As for bulk orders of TB15's, I'd be interested if the price was benificial to us.......You can get a 15% discount if you buy two tyres anyway........


I was quoted 20% without even pushing...



How about a 275/55/15 Pirelli P7, a bit tall but readily available.


What, Pirelli still make the P7? If they are I have to say that that was the best looking tire in history, I want those please....

[guy mayers]

Hi Tryphon, I have P Zero Assimetricos front and rear.
Guy

[Sando]

The Dunlops are street legal on one side apparently;) :)

For the P7's give Longstone tyres (one of the TB suppliers in the UK) a call. When I spoke to them at the Historic Motorsports show they were extremely friendly and helpful. I can't remember the guys name but he had a Beta and was very much a stratos fan. www.longstonetyres.co.uk (http://www.longstonetyres.co.uk) +44 1302 711123
They list them in their catalogue and he said he had some in stock too.
Check the profile and the diameter is ok though. As I said they are taller than the Yoko's and P Zero's.

let us know how you get on

cheers
Rob:cool:

[tryphon]

I finally went for the P Zero C in 205/50 and 225/50 for my Stradale set.

I think there's no better price/performance/durability ratio out there.

As for the P7 Pirelli makes a tire called P7 but it has nothing in common with the old one. Remember that the old P7 was the highest performer in the Pirelli range at that time.

[PANOS]

LIKE I SAID BEFORE, COUNT ME IN IN ANY JOINT EFFORT FOR MICHELIN TB/DUNLOP CR TYRES.

PANOS:cool:

[Cloggie]

Tryphon,
I've had the same experience as Guy with Yokohama tyres, same sizes and configuration.....

Okay in the dry, but deadly in the wet.....

I'm also runnig Pirelli Zero Asymetrico's, and I'm very happy with them. They were great on Zolder circuit last year. Lots of grip!!!

I've bought some Michelin TB's through Gerry and they were delivered last week. I'll get them tomorrow, but they looked excellent when I saw them at the Motorsport Show.

Gerry has manged to get the discounted price from Longstone Tyres for the Michelin's, so you may want to contact him to get this special discounted rate for club members:

2 x 295/15 = £320.26 +vat
2 x 215/15 = £276.00 + vat

Total was £700.61, including vat.

Cheers, Nico/

PS - Panos, if you want these discounted prices, you'll need to re-join the club! N/

[tryphon]

The Pirellis I bought are not the P Zero asymetricos but the P Zero C.
You can see them here:
http://www.pirellicompetizioni.com/en_41/products/catalogue_circuit.jhtml

As for the TBs they can be had at my usual Swiss dealer 20% cheaper than the prices you get.

[Cloggie]

20% cheaper? That's a real surprise! We costed it out with Longstone Tyres (Gerry's Suppliers, and they were

Is it including taxes and delivery? (These prices include UK-wide delivery.)

If so, we would consider your dealer for the consortium bid.

Please can you provide the contact details for your dealer so we can make an enquiry.

Looking forward to your response. Regards, Nico/

[guy mayers]

Hi Nico - don't forget that Tryphon doesn't have to pay the VAT on his tyres! Gerrys prices include it at 17.5% so unless everyone wants to drive over to Switzerland to collect them........... and they might just be worn out by the time you get back! A bulk order might sound attractive but by the time you've got them past customs and paid the shipping it will be too expensive!
Guy.

[tryphon]

It's Horag at: www.horag.com

They do all sorts of historic tires and they told me I can have a 20% discount on their list prices. The price doesn't include VAT (7.6% in Switzerland) but if it's for export the VAT is refunded.
I have not ordered yet my TBs but when the 12" wheels arrive I will.

I hope this helps,
Tryphon

[guy mayers]

Originally posted by tryphon

I have not ordered yet my TBs but when the 12" wheels arrive I will.



Does this mean the 8" have arrived???

Even if we could get the Swiss 7% back we would have to pay the 17.5% when the tyres cross the UK customs border. Otherwise it's called smuggling! It's certainly tax avoidance and anyone who is aware of the current scope of the new UK Money Laundering laws may feel constrained to report individuals if they become privy to that information in the course of their business as an accountant or solicitor or used car dealer etc etc.....
You really don't want to know about the penalties!
Guy

[tryphon]

Originally posted by guy mayers


Does this mean the 8" have arrived???



No, have they been sent? I sure hope so.

I never meant that anyone should "smuggle" anything anywhere.
I just said the tires are cheaper here.

One last note on TBs. I only get them because I have to as nothing else, of sensible size, will fit. I don't like tires made of "butter" as with these you can see your money melt away...

[chris.richard]

Originally posted by guy mayers

It's certainly tax avoidance

Isn't it tax evasion? I thought tax avoidance was legal?

[guy mayers]

These days schemes designed for tax avoidance have to be run past the IR to check they're legal. That way loopholes can be plugged more quickly!
Not that taxation is my specialist area but all the lectures and courses we've been on recently on money laundering makes me wonder if being in this industry on the audit side of the fence is really worth it any more. Lots of colleagues are thinking the same thing and I guess we just have to wait and see how things pan out. At some point in the future reality will have to step in or NCIS will be so inundated with reports from us accountants and solicitors that the whole system will collapse!
You're right about the avoidance/evasion but doing either deliberately knowing it to be wrong can drop you in it now!
Guy

[guy mayers]

Originally posted by tryphon


No, have they been sent? I sure hope so.

I

I have spoken to Gerry tonight who tells me that your fronts are on the way right now - please let us know what you think when they arrive Tryphon! Rears are about to go into production with Gerry pushing for a set for me in time for Stoneleigh in two weeks. Fingers crossed!

Guy

[tryphon]

As soon as they're here I'll let you know, but I already know what to expect. Compomotive are one of the best manufacturers out there, if not the best. I already have a set from them on my Cossie. I'm 100% sure these wheels will just be tops in terms of quality and looks.

[Cloggie]

Hi Tryphon,
I was at Gerry's yesterday, and saw your front wheels, and also Gerry's on his demo car. They looked excellent and I'm sure you'll be satisfied.

Regards, Nico/

[tryphon]

OK people, the wheels are here.

Before commenting I would like to thank everyone that made this result possible for their efforts, especially Gerry and Guy with which I had direct dealings.

Now about the wheels, what can I say, perfect.

Thinks I like:

- Perfect copies
- The color is just right
- Very good finish
- Perfect match on the hub
- Perfect fit of the stud inserts

Things I would have liked:

- Campagnolo stamping
- Center caps

Things I don't like:

- Not perfect paint close to the valve piercing
- Some lightly "missed" paint spots on the inside where the wheel was held in order to paint it

Overall I'm just happy and I'm sure the 12" ones will be just as great.

Thank you all again,
Tryphon

[tryphon]

No more guessing:

I had 2 TB15 26/61x15 delivered to my house today, total cost £385.

As for the PZeroC tires I paid £495 for 2x 205/50x15 and 2x 225/50x15.

These are the prices in Switzerland.

Cheers,
Tryphon